Hi all

[Peter]

Hello forum.
I'm Peter Cole and i live in Bristol, UK.

Just want to say hello and introduce myself properly. Not sure if this is the thread to use or not.

My present setup is as follows,
Meade DS 16 German mount, AWR Inteligent drive system, With 12" RA and 8" Dec wheels
Orion Optics (UK) 300mm F5.3 newt. In need of refurbishing.
Meade ETX 125 PE with BCF wedge and various acc, Sort of went mad as its so damn portable and fun to use.
Phillips SP900 Webcam
Astroart V 4.0
PS CS3 extended (Cheap from Amazon)

I have been interested in Astronomy from the Mercury, Apollo days when i was at school. Damn this is showing my age. I'm also looking to branch out into Astrophotography eventualy. I have no experience at all with imaging, Nor do i yet have what you would call a proper imaging camera.
About to start off with a Phillips SP900 webcam and the ETX, Keep it simple and stress free i hope.
Been trawling the various boards for info and advice, All i seem to find is info about 12"-32" RC rigs etc etc when i type in Astrophotography, Way out of my budget, Then i found you guys, 72mm 120mm and 250mm rigs, Atlas type/size mounts, Orion Starshooter and Starlight CCD's. Totaly blown away with all of your images.
I especialy like how you freely submit images and share advice and the general look and feel of this comunity.
I have learned a lot from browsing all your posts and the stunning photo's the last week or so and just want to say ,Thanks very much for showing what is possible without spending a fortune.

I wish you all clear skies and thanks again for sharing a brilliant forum

peter

[Doug]

Hi Peter,

Welcome!

We are a small group, however, we are always outreaching to recruit more members. Our small size allows us to help each other more on a one on one personal basis. We have many other member resources that are free. We have a FTP server that allows us to share large unprocessed files, and we also offer an image gallery that will allow you to share your photos not only here, but it allows you to share your photos in other forums.

I started with the same camera you have now! I think there is tremendous value in small aperture scopes...I really love my 72MM EON's wide field. Hang around and ask a few questions, and share your photos! Don't get intimidated by other photos in the Monthly Imaging Contest, I highly recommend entering all of your AP photos here. The only way you become better is by practice.

When I get home tonight, I'll find my first Orion M42 image...well I don't know if you can really call it an AP image But the point I am making is we all start less than perfect, and we advance our skills with practice. You should try Jupiter with your web cam. It's big and bright right now. Gosh, I can't remember the name of the free processing software right now for web cams, but I'll look it up when I get home.

I hope to see you around here more!

Doug

[mamill]

Hey Peter, welcome to the site. We all start off somewhere so never be afraid to ask questions, it's the only way we learn. I prefer smaller forums also because the folks tend to be friendlier and more helpful.
With your Philips webcam you should be able to take some very nice images of the planets (Jupiter is prime now) and the moon. It probably won't work well for deepsky unless you get it "modded". The program you need for stacking your image files for the webcam is called Registax. It's a free download and works well.
Just so you get a sense of where I started off here is a pic of M45 taken a few years back with the same scope I use now but with a Nikon D70 and mounted on an LXD55 mount (compare this to the one I took that is now gracing the splash page!) Without the help of these small sites and talented people I would not have gotten this far. It's a long road but a lot of fun.

My 1st M45

[Peter]

Hi Doug and Mike
Thanks for the very warm welcome. Looking forward to getting set up and posting some photo's, I'm off to crete next week, Hope next year to have a permanent rig out there with the ETX, I can buy it a seat pretty cheaply.
I do like the forums and the way they sort of flow as you progress with all of your images, From what i have read and seen, You have got the image processing down to a fine art between you all, I realise its a huge learning curve for me, But with stunning results at the end.
From looking and reading the posts, I have a very good grounding now in what a decent imaging rig consists of, So in time it will come together.

I will check out registax and any other software you recomend.
Have a great evening, Chat again soon

Peter

[Doug]

Hi Peter,

Here is my first image of M42...had to start some where!


Compare this shot to my M42 taken 11 months later:

Click on image for larger version.

Your right Mike! I couldn't remember Registax!

[Peter]

Good morning Doug.
Wow that is probably the most beautiful photo of M42 i have ever seen, I never realised it had so much Blue in it.
Was that taken with a One shot colour or RGB.
Seeing the difference between both images over 11 months is amazing

I found registax and i also came across CCD calc, Lets me see different fields of view with different camera/scope combinations. This is the link, But maybe you and Mike have it already.

http://www.newastro.com/book_new/camera_app.php

Peter

[Doug]

Hi Peter,

Thanks for the comments about M42. One thing you'll find about Astrophotography is it's made up of 50% of the actually image, 50% artistic processing, and 100% trying different things! Wait that's 200%, yep that's about right!

Seriously when you start processing your image write a "basic" guide of how you created your image. I wrote a list of steps for myself when I started, and I used that list of steps for a few months...then you start experimenting, and becoming more creative.

My M42 is blue because of a processing experiment. It was so blue because I used a florescent bulb for flats. I have retried M42 again with different flats and got different results. I really don't think I have processed the same image the same way twice...its all random chaos!

BTW, this was taken with a SSPro OSC V1 camera.

Another note about my first experience processing...I was so frustrated! I seriously almost gave up this hobby because I was so frustrated with processing. Probably because the morning after I was tired from being up all night, and started working on my images. Don't give up! Processing is something you will learn, and you'll keep learning more during your astrophotography career.

If you get stuck, post it here, and we'll see what we can help you with!

[Peter]

Hi Doug and Mike
I do like the Blue, For me it enhances its over all beauty, Like you say its all down to how we see things and what looks good for us.

I think i mentioned I'm off to family home this week in Crete for a fortnights break. It's seeing the night sky out there that got me thinking more and more of photography side of Astronomy.
So have decided long term imaging will be done out in Crete, I intend to move out permanently in about 3 years or less anyway, So will start to gear up there over time, More sensible than trying to image here in the UK, Our light pollution and weather combination is terrible. Better start saving the pennies and Euros.
I think i have settled on a rig that will work well together, Based around the Sony 6.7mm x 8.9 mm chip. Reviews state low noise, High efficiency as against the kodak equivalent. Plus seeing the results your getting, It's a damn good chip.


Using my base 12" F 5.3 with JMI NGF 2 on the Meade DS 16 mount ( 15 x 19 arc minutes FOV mono)
Imaging system would be...
80mm Meade 5000 with Ascom driver Motor focus ( 48 x 64 arc minutes FOV.. 0.8 Reducer flatner is 60 x 80 arc minutes FOV mono )
WO 72mm/70mm or similar for guide scope.
WO 0.8 Flatner 3 or TV 0.8 Flatner.

CCD train would be or similar...
Orion SS Pro 111 mono or the SS Pro Colour V2 ( The UK price for each is almost the same £ 1300 for the Pro 111...£1267 for the Pro colour V2. )
Orion Starshooter guide camera.
Starlight eXpress 7 slot USB filter wheel. Camera dependant.
Baader/Astronomik LRGB filter set. Camea dependant.

Atik do a complete mono imaging train.
Atik 314L+ with 16-IC Autoguider, Atik EFW 5 slot USB Filter Wheel, Baader LRGB Filter Set, ST-4 Guide Cable, Complete Image Aquisition Software.

With 320 clear nights a year on average in Crete, I think this would be a nice rig combination to go for.

If you were both starting from fresh again, How would you go. Your comments will be very appreciated.

Peter

[Doug]

Hi Peter,

I think the two cameras you mentioned have pros and cons to each camera.

The SSIII will take fantastic deep detail photos, the noise on this camera is perfect...NO Noise!

The SSPro chip is WIDE field chip, and will not pick up the faint details as good as the SSIII. With wide fields you don't really care too much about the details.

If I had to do it all over again?

I still would have purchased the Atlas mount...regardless! A sturdy mount is a must!
I would have purchased the 72MM EON, and NOT the more expensive EON120. The EON72 works fantastic for WIDE FIELDS, and the SSpro.

The camera...I am torn on this one. I have tried the SSIII and loved it! The SSIII performs well with narrowband filters, and the EON72. If you get the EON72 or any small refractor you'll need a Field Flattener, so budget another $265 IF YOU Decide on the larger SSPro chip...the smaller SSIII chip doesn't need the field flattener.

I think I chose the SSPro because of my budget. No extra filters, and quick turn around on getting fast results.
However,
The SSIII is by far a superior camera when it comes to pulling out the details. If you have the extra cash go for the SSIII you will not be disappointed, if you are strapped for cash, and if weather plays a big part in your location, go for the SSPro.

Gordon lives in the UK too, and he seems to be very successful with his Mono Imaging.

Flip a coin! Just remember, what ever decision you make...it WILL be the right one for you. You'll get lots of different opinions, but at the end of the day you only need to make one person satisfied, and that's you!

Good Luck!

[Peter]

Good morning Doug.

Seeing whats been done with both single shot and tri colour imaging, Its going to be a difficult one to choose. The larger chip sure does have its allure. I must admit i am looking more at the smaller chip with filters. Go mono processing first with maybe Ha as a later option. Then branch into tri colour, Once i have learned the ropes, The image data once saved can be added to later exposures. Small and steady steps.

From what your saying and what i have seen with the images here, The longer or deeper the exposure, The better the final image, ie 5 x 10 mins ( x RGB ) mono would be better than 3x 5 x 10 mins single shot colour due to the sensitivity of the chip types
One thing that is puzzling me, What does weighting of exposures mean when using different filters. Does it apply to the camera exposure with the type/make of the filter, ie Do you expose for longer using an Astronomik blue filter than you would with say a Baader blue filter or am i missing the point completely.

Sorry if i sound a plonker, But the more i delve into the art of processing, The more questions keep popping up

Peter